ebay intake flanges?

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Buffalobill
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ebay intake flanges?

Post by Buffalobill » 03 Sep 2019, 21:49

so who's bought or fabbed intake flanges and made a tunnel ram?

i saw dick Datson did in a book i acquired, but he ran dual 2 barrel carbs.

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63larkr1
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by 63larkr1 » 03 Sep 2019, 22:11

I had the flanges made so I could get the correct angles to enter the head. I made two tunnel rams for my car, here is the one I have on my car now.
Richard
2018 intake (4).JPG
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Buffalobill
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by Buffalobill » 03 Sep 2019, 22:35

nice intake, what carb do you run on that?

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Mike Van Veghten
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by Mike Van Veghten » 04 Sep 2019, 01:22

Not many, but a fine idea as long as you have hood clearance..!

Design things to think about -

1. Long runners help lower rpm power.

2. Short runners help higher rpm power.

3. Plenum volume should be about the same size as the engine. That is, a 299cu. in. engine, a good starting point for the manifold plenum should be about 299CC's . This is a very good starting point.

This way, as noted, the manifold runners can be properly located to make the them the same as the cylinder port runner, angle wise. A nice clean straight line.
With a change in plenum tops, two small carburetors or one larger carburetor could be used. A pair of Webbers, the big Ford inline carburetor...or better yet throttle bodies for direct port fuel injection. Use your imagination on this one.

Mike

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PackardV8
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by PackardV8 » 04 Sep 2019, 08:08

Since the Stude intake ports are lower than ideal because keeping the carb under the hood was a prime directive, I've always wondered if an intake manifold on the order of the Mopar Max Wedge might work.

Image

jack vines

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63larkr1
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by 63larkr1 » 05 Sep 2019, 18:07

Intake 2018 (2).JPG
I'm using a Mighty Demon 750. I ran the car last night at Muncie in good conditions and in 9 passes all but two were 118+ mph almost 119. The other two were 117+. 95.7+ at the eighth mile. Still my 60' times are slower than last year. Sorry the pictures are sideways!
2018 intake (1).JPG
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63larkr1
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by 63larkr1 » 07 Sep 2019, 17:28

This is a tuned intake, or as close as I can get it. You kind of chase your tail, but you need to settle on something. It's the third tunnel ram I have used,and the second one I built. It works best of the three. The plenum is about 80% of the engine size on this one and the last intake plenum was bigger. To tune the intake one of the things you need to know is peak HP RPM, so a trip to the dyno is a must.
After you build the intake the peak HP Rpm may change.
Just dive in and get to work doing the best you can and we will learn from it. That's were the fun comes in.
Richard
Studebaker Drag Racing You can't beat it.
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Mike Van Veghten
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by Mike Van Veghten » 07 Sep 2019, 19:53

How did you decide on the runner length ?

Nicely done by the way.

Mike

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63larkr1
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by 63larkr1 » 07 Sep 2019, 23:13

I gave all my specs to Tom and he ran them through pipe max. I selected the harmonic that I could practically build for best performance on my engine.
Richard
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Jeff Rice
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by Jeff Rice » 08 Sep 2019, 07:17

As to the OP's original question...
Those Ebay flanges are (a) steel, and (b) port cuts are 90 degrees.
Not ideal for an intake flange. Either you will end up with a small 'Z' step in the manifold runner to intake runner, or you will have a hard turn if you came straight off (90 degree's) the intake flange.
Best to have a flange that has the port angle built into it.
But you all know that already.

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Jeff Rice
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by Jeff Rice » 08 Sep 2019, 08:02

PackardV8 wrote:
04 Sep 2019, 08:08
Since the Stude intake ports are lower than ideal because keeping the carb under the hood was a prime directive, I've always wondered if an intake manifold on the order of the Mopar Max Wedge might work.

Image

jack vines
Those cross rams are quite tall, so the under hood idea kind of flys out the window..
But... They are still around for the SBC, so one could be tried with a set of Jon Kammer's adapters.
It would be interesting to see what the 'ideal' runner length is for a Stude V8.
Mapping the stock cast iron manifold would give you a baseline that could be extrapolated for an 'idle to 5000' rpm range.
But I have never heard of anyone flow testing a head to see what the flow rates are at specific runner lengths.
Might be an interesting graph. Perhaps the Stude head might favor a specific set of runners like the old (now we have to call them 'old' <lol>) BBC heads.
Interesting conversation.

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63larkr1
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by 63larkr1 » 08 Sep 2019, 10:13

As I said I had mine made so I could get the correct angle in to the head. The last picture is my first intake and I made the flanges myself to get the correct angle, and had some tubing bent to 30 degrees so it would enter the head at the correct angle. The intake flange will sit around 20 degrees on the heads, but the intake runner is around 30 degrees, so to get a direct shot in to the runner I added the bend.
The carb should be around two or three inches above the floor of the plenum and not flat. The runners need to be the correct length and size to match or tuned the harmonics the engine. This I think is why the stock intake works so well. Exhaust header should also match the engine. This will fill the combustion chamber efficiently and remove the exhaust gasses so the air fuel mixture for combustion is the best it can be. Getting this correct will create scavenging that will pull the exhaust out and the intake mixture in. Think of a train with all the cars hooked together pulling the next car.
This is just a quick review and doesn't cover every thing or contain ever detail.
The visual impact of the intake is also a big factor in this intake design. The new intake has 22% bigger runners than the first intake, and I used a different harmonic. This doesn't cover everything, but it gives you and idea what to consider.
Thanks, Richard
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The 11th annual all Studebaker Nationals Drag Race is Saturday May 25th, 2018 at 9:00 am at Brown County Dragway in Bean Blossom, Indiana. For more information contact Richard Poe

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Mike Van Veghten
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by Mike Van Veghten » 08 Sep 2019, 10:41

Nice, thanks for the detail shots.
Yes, all of the details have a reason for being designed to do a particular job. Various runner lengths in the intake have very much the same (only a little more) effect than the primary tube length on the headers.

As I noted earlier, if you want more top end power, shorten the runner length. Longer for low rpm power. Similar for plenum size.
Many years back one of the magazines printed a picture of a shelf in Warren Johnson's shop, musta been 200+ intake manifolds. Different plenum's, different runner lengths and shapes.

A friend of mine runs a 273", big block Dodge in C/ED. Runs in the 7.20/7.25 (1/4 mile) range. He's got a small hand full of intake manifolds, all by Hogan (expensive !).
He's narrowed pretty much down to two, depending on what altitude he's racing at. A really short runner for low tracks and one about 1-1/4" longer for higher altitude tracks.

Just like when the old "port" injection was the rage back in the 70's/80's. Guys had various length velocity stacks...for the same exact reason. Now days, the guys still running the port injection seem to be running a shorter velocity stack, but are running shorter gears to make up for the power difference and are running quicker.
Again...all about "combinations" (of parts).

As most racers find, change one thing, it affects other things in the combination. Experimentation is the key to success.

Mike

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63larkr1
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by 63larkr1 » 08 Sep 2019, 11:33

Thanks Mike,
I made 9 or 10 runs at Muncie Dragway Wednesday and all but two were over 118MPH for the best night ever for MPH. I'm still on stock brakes so that's fast enough for me right now. I had to make a rear gear change last fall after stripping all the teeth off my 4.09 gears at Martin. I'm running 4.27 gears since I had no 4.09 gears. I needed to get them in quickly to get the car ready for the Muscle Car And Corvette Nationals. I was invited to represent Studebaker Drag racing and performance. I don't show my cars but this would be an exception. Anyway, this year with the 4.27 gears I can't get the car off the line as quick as last year mostly I just spin on the little 9" slicks. So MPH was up even though I'm at around 6200RPMs with a 4" stroke. This intake seems to have Great low end torque but also big end speed, even with the really bad aerodynamics. I don't use a hood and the intake and the scoop rob power. The visual look of the car is a consideration at the track since it's not a car people see everyday. I did win a Pick of the Show award at the MCACN.
I had some advice on the intake from a guy that built PS intakes, mostly on the inside of the plenum. It's not cost effective to have one built and find out it will not work so my wife said get a tig welder and do it yourself, she is almost always correct.
We gave every kid in this picture their own copy of TW Magazine. I give up some performance for maybe a future Studebaker fan.
Thanks,
Richard
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Champion V8
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Re: ebay intake flanges?

Post by Champion V8 » 19 Sep 2019, 17:21

Mike, I sure wonder about the "273 big block Dodge"! Is it a down-sized 361 or..?

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